Saturday, February 13, 2016

A Dragon Ball Fanboy vs Akira Toriyama and Toei part 5: The Right Way To Power a Character Up! (round two)

This post is a direct continuation of my last post, part 4 in A Dragon Ball Fanboy vs. Akira Toriyama:

In the last part, I ran with the theory of all the Z fighters including all the human protagonists getting serious about protecting the Earth after Frieza's last invasion.  To that end, I had included Piccolo and Tien training on King Kai's planet and mastering several levels of the Kaioken.  Piccolo took the training and used it as a basis for the rest of his training and Tien did the same.

Now also in that last scenario, I had other humans train with Tien.  My list of humans that trained with King Kai were Tien, Yamcha, and Chiaotzu but this time they were joined by Krillin, #18 aka Lazuli, and Master Roshi for some good ol' fashioned perverted comic relief and cuz it'd be cool to see two of Goku's old masters getting together and recollecting the journey that the Saiyan fighter has blazed throughout the years.

Now for this to work, I'll have to move forward in the timeline a bit from my last post a few weeks ago.  Dragon Ball Super has changed the catalyst for all my powerups by having Piccolo get revived instantly, thusly he doesn't go training on Kai's planet in the afterlife right after his death.  However, that's not to say that the humans have no motivation to seek out Kai.  So I'll say that this power boost happens during either the few months timeskip between RoF and the U6 Tournament or it happens after the U6 tournament.


Motivation: To be his wife's equal in protecting their family and to make a difference in defending Earth.

The battle against Frieza changes something in all of the human Z-Fighters, especially Krillin.  Things change when the bad guys start bringing thousands of soldiers to the party.  In order to be of more use and better prepared for similar invasions in the future Krillin and Tien meet and have a discussion about Earth's protection.  What should happen if Goku was stuck in space like he was with Frieza latest trip to Earth.  Tien and Krillin agree that it can't be helped if some monster like Frieza comes.  The wise old perverted Master Roshi overhears them, as does #18 and there is a tense frustration within the group.  #18 gets upset that the men have abandoned their fighting spirits in the face of powerful opponents.  It sparks a fire in everyone, Roshi included.  Tien mentions that he never completed his training under King Kai, despite being there for who knows how long.  Krillin tells him that he never trained with the North Galaxy ruler.  Tien mentions Kai's training regiment and the 10x gravity on his planet.  Roshi, Tien, Krillin, and even 18 all agree that they need to train hard.  They telepathically call out to King Kai and he agrees to train them all again.  They tell Yamcha about it and of course Chiaotzu learns about it as well.  They leave Marron with Gohan and Videl for a while, while they go off to train.  They go to the lookout and Dende takes them to the start of Snake Way.

Now let's get to the training.  The experience of high gravity is new to Krillin so he initially has to adjust to that.  We see in an earlier saga that Piccolo, being stronger than Goku when he first arrived, has no trouble at all with the gravity.  But later on Gohan, whose power blows them both out the water at the time, still struggled with the high gravity.  So I think Krillin would struggle for a bit too.  After he gets used to the gravity, he begins to spar with Yamcha.  He also notices that Tien is doing some advanced stuff over with King Kai, including a move he saw Goku use a few times, the Kaioken.  Krillin and Yamcha get a lot stronger and they watch as Tien goes one on one with #18 while trying out his new technique.  Krillin wonders how Tien has always been so strong, how they've been neck in neck in power even when Krillin had gotten much of his potential unlocked.  He even curses himself for slacking off, guessing that Tien has already surpassed him.  He asks Tien to spar with him and Tien proves that he is the superior fighter even still.  Krillin continues his training and sees that Tien's boosts in power are getting even greater.  It's something to do with the technique that King Kai has taught him.  Even though he still loses to #18 Tien still puts up a much better fight than he did before, even surprising her at a few points.  Krillin is now motivated to learn the Kaioken.  He remembers when Goku used it against Nappa.

By Maffo1989

Krillin learns the Kaioken but quickly learns that his body can only take a certain amount of strain.  Tien seems to be able to boost himself to insane degrees with it, almost like a Saiyan, all thanks to his comfort with life-or-death techniques.  Krillin eventually overcomes his initial x5 limit and is able to max out his Kaioken at x10.  He uses his Kaioken in conjunction with his other techniques like the Scatter Kamehameha to create some devastating combinations.  He challenges Tien again and they have an even match with the x10 Kaioken, with Krillin having a bit of an edge in their fight.  Krillin knows that Tien can push himself upwards to x50 but Krillin is satisfied with being able to use the Kaioken to amplify his own techniques to even greater levels rather than his body.  In this way, Krillin becomes the technique master that he is destined to become in Dragon Ball Online.


Motivation: To protect her husband and daughter from universal threats using the power she was cursed with.

Continuing from Krillin's path, #18 starts her training journey in a bit of a rut.  Because she is so much stronger than the others she doesn't initially gain as much as they do from the training.  The gravity barely affects her movements so she doesn't have to get accustomed to it like Krillin.  Tien mainly uses #18 as a sparring partner to gauge his progress.  Master Roshi tries to cop a few feels under the guise of training with her.  He also teaches her some turtle school techniques like the Kamehameha.  During this training we learn some unique things about #18 source of energy.  King Kai refers to her "ki" as unnatural but states that he can feel it buzzing all around her in an endless cycle.  He has her demonstrate by shooting a ki blast and when she does he notes that her energy source replenishes itself almost instantly.  He then has he use a bigger blast, the Kamehameha that Master Roshi was taught her.  She uses a huge blast and King Kai notices that her energy returns a little more slowly when she expends it on a large ki draining technique.

By OPunkreas
#18 decides to have a spar against all of Kai's students like Piccolo did during the Namek Arc.  She goes through everyone mostly with ease until Tien and Krillin get serious and use their x10 Kaioken.  She commends them for getting so much stronger but tells them that the still have a long way to go until she is nearly defeated by Tien's x50 Kaioken until King Kai stops the fight due to Tien's overexertion.  Now with two suitable sparring partners, #18 can finally increase her physical strength through intense sparring.  After seeing how strong Tien and Krillin have gotten with the Kaioken, #18 tries to get Kai to teach it to her as well.  Kai states that #18 can't learn the Kaioken because it would create an unstable effect with her type of energy.  He teaches her some of the properties of the Kaioken to help her form a version of it that is a little weaker but lacks the ki and body strain.  She learns to at least double her strength with a technique she calls "Heating Up."  She continues her training with Krillin on Earth and they both continue to hone their skills.  There's also potential for #18 to even get an upgrade from Bulma and her dad.  There's literally limitless potential to her character.  We just don't know about the limits of science and her type of energy in Dragon Ball.  Maybe both her and android #17 can come back and get a power up to defend the Earth.



By EmiyanSaiyan

Motivation: Wants his dad to be proud of him and wants to be able to defend the Earth like Gohan did when he was younger.

In the latest episode of DBS, Vegeta told Trunks that the little warrior couldn't compete in the tournament because he needed to strengthen himself as opposed to relying on fusion.  This combined with the fact that his mother recently told him and Goten about the battle with Cell and the Androids.  Trunks was baffled to hear that his future self was so strong, even stronger than Piccolo and about as strong as Vegeta.  This sparks a desire in him to get much stronger.

Now at this point strengthening up Goten and Trunks goes against what was established with the End of DBZ,  Trunks and Goten are shown to have slacked off, with them being scared of fighting Buu in the tournament.  But since they've already produced a retcon in Super (Goku telling Vegeta about Uub when he seemingly first told him about Uub in the EoZ tournament) I simply don't care.  We're also never told exactly how strong the boys have become so let's go ahead and power them up.

By Cauai-desu

Trunks and Goten are the perfect sparring partners.  Both are Saiyans, both are sons of proud warriors, both are competitive and have a rivalry, and both are the best of friends.  They can and will always be able to push each other to new limits when it comes to training together.  Both boys train amongst themselves in the days leading up to the U6 tournament and after the tournament is over they ask their fathers to train them.  This training lasts for a little while until Goku and Vegeta get caught up in their own training again.  The boys then turn to Gohan, who they notice is getting a lot stronger than he was against the Evil Majin Buu on his own.  Gohan teaches the boys the basics and then spars with them from time to time.  They do this almost daily and all of them benefit from the training.  Goten and Trunks benefit the most and they manage to raise their levels past Gohan's when he fought against Cell by unlocking Super Saiyan 2.  The boy's next goal is to unlock Super Saiyan 3 and get stronger on their own than they were as Gotenks.  They get bored with this however and ask their fathers about Super Saiyan God.  Now here's where we'll go with different paths for the boys to make things interesting.

By Immateengohan
Path 1: Goku and Vegeta see that the boys are making some major gains in strength and decide to take them under their wing and teach them about SSG (Super Saiyan God) in order to prepare for a looming threat.  Together Goku and Vegeta teach Trunks and Goten how to control their ki in order to harness God Mode.  The boys attain SSB (Super Saiyan Blue) and are right under Goku and Vegeta's level.

Path 2: Half Saiyans can't become SSG.  Goku and Vegeta tell the boys this and they are forced to go back to their original Super Saiyan 3 training.  The boys easily become SSJ3's because their bodies remember the feeling of the form from being fused.  They consider it a dumb form because it makes them tired to quickly and so they fused into Gotenks in order to get some better ideas about transforming.  As Gotenks they discover a form similar to Super Saiyan 4 that powers them up greatly.  The boys keep this a secret until the next big villain where they reveal their new form that they called Super Omega Gotenks.

By hddragonballafhd

Path 3: Gohan teaches the boys the path he has taken to Godhood.  He teaches them Elder Kai's method of gaining god ki and they power up tremendously with relaxed "base forms".  They can then power up in Super Saiyan form though the multiplier isn't the same since they can already access most of their power in base form.

Path 4: The boys give up once they master SSJ2 and start relying on Gotenks again, but he's a lot stronger now, able to keep up with God Level fighters.  At this point they start slacking off, slowly becoming their End of Z selves.


By Vicdbz

Motivation: Wants to be able to defend the Earth without fusion like his older brother did and father did.  Wants to train with Trunks.

Goten's training journey is the same as Trunks'. Also, it would be cool if he decided to mimic Yamcha's fighting style as he grew older, since he looks similar to him and chases girls like him at the end of Z.  That's the closest we'd get to a Saiyan Yamcha lol.


Motivation: Wants to be able to lend a hand when the Earth is in danger.  Training with Tien, Krillin, and Chiaotzu reminds him of the old days reigniting old rivalries.

I don't have much for Yamcha.  I used to believe in the guy but he seems to fade away more and more with each new arc.  Continuing from the Krillin powerup, we have a Yamcha who is determined to get stronger no matter what.  As always, however, he still greatly lags behind both Krillin and Tien.  His gains will be great, just like theirs.  I believe he can master the Kaioken very well but I don't think his mastery will approach the same levels as Krillin or Tien, neither will his application of the technique to his other techniques.  I can see Yamcha maxing out his Kaioken at a x5, which is half of what I had for Krillin.  So Yamcha can get pretty powerful, but I can't see him catching up with the other two especially Tien who never stops training and Krillin who had his potential unlocked and who spars with a Super Saiyan level opponent in his wife.  It would be cool if Yamcha focused on his speed more so that he would be the fastest Earthling fighter, you know, something to call his own.  Imagine a high speed wolf fang assault from the master of the Wolf Fang Fist.  T'would be baddass!  Maybe afterwards he can train Goten, like I alluded to above.  It wouldn't make a ton of sense--well no it would--since Goku seems more interested in training foreign children who are the reincarnation of ancient demons anyway.  Yamcha and Goten could be like a bro version of Gohan and Piccolo.  I'd watch that spinoff.


Motivation: Tags along with Tien and wants to be of use to him.

I really don't have much to say for Chiaotzu.  Maybe I shouldn't have even added him to the training, but we all know that wherever Tien goes, Chiaotzu follows.  Chiaotzu should also be fairly above Master Roshi so it'll be interesting to see if Roshi can catch up to him at least.  Chiaotzu may secretly be a badass though.  He was on Kai's planet almost as long as Tien was, but Tien usually leaves him behind during hectic encounters.  IDK this one's tough.  Chaiotzu does get much stronger but I don't see him learning Kaioken.  He seems rather delicate when you get right down to it.  But I do think he can at least get strong enough to wipe the floor with Ginyu level goons, if he's not already.

Master Roshi 

Motivation: Even though his fighters have long since left him in the dust, he wants to be able to better defend his planet against the likes of ruthless aliens like Frieza's soldiers.

Roshi is training again, what more can I say?  Roshi reveals that he's been secretly training this whole time on Earth to which Yamcha, Tien, and Krillin all go "duh" collectively after his good showing against many of Frieza's soldiers.  Master Roshi has a difficult time with the gravity since he's so old and he still wears his weighted turtle shell.  He gets to Kai's planet later than the others since he still can't fly.  He gains a lot of strength just from running down the entirety of Snake Way.  His power jumps from the mid-hundreds to the mid-thousands like the boys' did when they first trained with King Kai.  Roshi also helps the boys refine their technique, teaching Yamcha and Krillin the buff form as a way to release massive amounts of their own power.  He also teaches #18 the Kamehameha Wave.  Even with this training session, the master isn't able to surpass his students and he is unable to learn the Kaioken thanks to his old body.  Roshi does take what he's learned from Kaio back to Earth to advance his Turtle School style.

Welp, that ladies and gents is my list of how to power up some fan favorite characters.  What I really don't like about new Dragon Ball, from the Buu saga onwards, is how they neuter so many fan favorite characters just to progress the plot and a handful of Saiyans.  Goku and Vegeta need powerful allies and even if their allies aren't quite as strong as they are, these warriors should not just stop their quest for martial mastery and perfection.

Well anyways, thanks for reading my ramblings my glorious readers!  You all have a great weekend!


  1. Wow! Another great post! I have exams from the end of this month to the end of the next, so I won't be able to check in here regularly, but I can't wait to see everything you would have cooked up by the time I get back ! I'll tell all my friends about your blog
    Cheers !
    I'm writing a theory of my own, taking inspiration from your great work, & I will post a link to it here by like tomorrow.

  2. Thank you! There's probably even more I could've written regarding #18, since she's such a mystery. Maybe some alternate paths.

    Oh, I can't wait to read some of your posts! Feel free to post your link here when you finish. Good luck on your exams!

  3. Universe 7 is the prime universe- proof of this is that it has the best food.
    The ultimate warrior Beerus dreamed about was part of a prophecy that an ultimate warrior who bowed to noone & in whose chest 4 heroic hearts, heroic in 4 different ways, beat, it was his destiny to defeat the God of destruction of the prime universe- & start a multiversal reconfiguration.
    This Warrior would be formed from 4 warriors- Goku, Vegeta, Piccolo & Tien.
    Piccolo would either become Golden Piccolo or some sort of namekian God in his own right.
    Tien would become sort of war God with 3 eyes & 4 arms, his four arms technique being foreshadowing for this. Basically, the 3 eyed beings were some sort of minor alien gods who came to earth & Tien happens to be part war God & in course of time releases his inner war God & godly ki & because of his previous training & training he will do will become the strongest war God ever, as much stronger than a regular war God as Goku & Vegeta are stronger than the original SSj God. It makes sense for Tien to no not be entirely human, because he is stronger than krillin but toriyama still calls krillin the strongest human. Tien will now become a rival to Goku once again. Tien won't be quite as strong as a goku or a vegeta but he will acquire the ability to perfom multiform without splitting his power (up till a certain number, maybe 4) & all the tien clones (each as strong as the original) fighting together will be no less powerful than Goku or Vegeta.
    Piccolo may just end up the strongest z fighter or maybe they all will be equals- god-tier the four of them. Piccolo, Goku, Vegeta, and Tien exemplify the spirit of the show more than any other character. They are the true warriors who never stop striving to reach the next level.
    Beerus & Whis will merge (the purpose of a powerful attendant in the first place) & become a really powerful destruction incarnate God of destruction.

    The 4 heroes will merge & become the ultimate warrior of legend (the one from beerus' dreams), beat the merged whis-beerus hybrid & begin a reconfiguration event that spreads to the other universes resulting in everything changing.

    The ending will pretty much be the ending of the chronicles of Narnia, the heroes & brave & heroic characters met during the 3 series of Dragonball will awaken in the paradise beyond life- life was a dream, & time they have awakened to the eternal paradise beyond time. The 12 universes were a passing thing, this is what is truly real.

    1. WoooooooooW! Dude, that was just amazing! I really like that scenario you painted. Seriously, these are my favorite Z Fighters and seeing them all work together again to defeat power threats would be a dream! If Toriyama doesn't write this then I think you should definitely do a fanfic on it. I never thought of them all combining like that in some new epic fusion. The only thing I don't care for is Golden Piccolo, since we've already seen Golden Frieza and Piccolo would look pretty horrible covered in gold. But man do I hope Toriyama does something like this, with these 4 characters in particular.